O’Connor pulls out of mayor race:

Explaining his decision to stop campaigning with less than a week to go before polling day, Mr O'Connor said "he had been unhappy with the lack of coverage he was getting from the media". Just as expected and due to his hunger for media attention at long last his past exploitation of the underdog has finally caught up with him. Time now Matt to put your own house in order before messing up the lives of others as indeed you did do with F4J.

Goodness me, all these English nationalists falling over themselves to defend these rather silly anti Scottish English Democrat posters yet were they not the same people who frothed at the mouth when the http://www.cornishnotenglish.com website was porduced?

I wholeheartedly agree with you comments. England's questioning of itself is warmly welcomed as is Scotland finally exerting some national interest out loud. But this kind of poster will do the EDs no favours whatsoever.

Dunno..

Are the Scots a race?

Are the English a race?

Are the Corns a race?

Is the Scot run British Government racist towards the English?

The English certainly don't get as good a deal financially (Barnett Formula) or democratically (where's our Parliament or assembly?)

Having said that - I think the English Democrats could have come up with an equally powerful message without even mentioning Scotland.

I believe that's the Maltese Cross.

And before you ask, I have no idea why the English Democrats are using it.

The English democrats are going for maximum publicity on a small budget, and measured on those terms they have done very well. However, Kilroy and Veritas got good publicity but no one took them seriously. We'll have to wait and see whether anyone actually listens to what the EDP have to say. I suspect not, but good luck to them.

As I reported on my blog the EngDems and Matt O'Connor are setting up a 'hard-hitting' rival to the Campaign for an English Parliament, so perhaps we are in for some Fathers for Justice type stunts in the name of England. Should be fun.

Happy St George's Day!

I definitely think it is time for a left or centre/centre English nationalist party and the English Democrats don't fit the bill, because their main interest is attacking Scotland and Wales UKIP fashion, and they don't seem to have that much interest in breaking the union. Such a party would do well to relate to the traditions mentioned in Billy Bragg's "The Progressive Patriot". Celebrate the Chartists, not the Queen.

By the way, while I think they're entitled to question a "tartan tax" (although there are plenty of examples of money going the other way - Scots helped fund Wembley, and are part funding the Olympics) - racial caricatures like this would not be tolerated if the person in the image was non-white.

As someone who would like to see England secede from the UK, I find the EDP difficult to support as they are very wooly on the independence issue (one of the reasons why the Free England Party was formed earlier this year, I beleive) and their policies, despite what they claim, are a bit too right-wing for my liking. Ads like this one and the recent party political broadcast recently have only confirmed my suspicion that they are simply British nationalists who rather than wishing Scotland and Wales well in the progress that their national governments have made, especially since parties with the best interests of Scotland and Wales (at least partially) at heart are in power, and working towards achieving the same thing for England (including fiscal independence which would put an end to any arguement over Barnett subsidies) they would prefer a return to the pre-devolution status quo. Sadly, they are becoming a bit of a joke.

BTW, Happy St. George's day all!!!!!

When is the English question going to be treated by mature and responsible English nationalists as opposed to the finge elements and marginals it is currently infested with as the above demonstrates?

Is it racist, really? The extent to which it is racist could be seen as a function of how much actual offence it causes to Scots, and how much real malice and prejudice it expresses towards the Scots. I don't think either measures are particularly high; it's just having a (possibly tasteless) joke at . . . their expenses.

Tactically, I don't think it'll do the English Democrats any harm either. On the contrary, it's getting them noticed, provoking discussion and earning air time in a contest that the media seems determined to shape into a three-horse race. Sometimes shock tactics are what's required; and actually, the fact that it uses a 'bad' pun (can there be such a thing?) makes for good advertising, appeals to the red-top readers who make up a large part of the EDs' target voters, and is . . . typically English. And it gets across one of the core issues very pithily.

The number of potential ED voters who will be put off voting for them by this ad is minimal, I'd have thought; certainly less than the number that will be attracted to the cause. This may be a rather crude, 'working-class'-type message - unappealing to middle-class political correctness; but then, how many such people would give the idea of voting ED any serious thought? It'll be interesting to see what the advertising standards authority has to say about it.

David, aka Britology Watch

Well it's got them attention, and that was the point. But as Gareth said, whether they are taken seriously or not remains to be seen.

I don't think it is racist though, it is just a stereotype, part of a long tradition of banter between England and Scotland. Well, no more racist than a French onion seller in a beret or an English toff in a bowler hat would be.

Well, the latest YouGov poll ( 21-04-08 ) has the EDP on 1% of first intentions.

For comparison the Greens are on 3% and the BNP and UKIP are also on 1%.

On second preference they are on 3%, behind the Greens (12%), UKIP (6%) and BNP (5%).

So they are not doing that well compared to the other smaller parties. Not being a Londoner I don't understand the voting system but I wouldn't imagine that this translates into any seats.

It's certainly pathetic.

It certainly makes a joke of the constant comment (stemming from a unique cultural bubble) that the movement for Scottish self-determination is based on anti-Englishness, which it most certainly is not.

Yes it's racist. But it's also failed to cause the stir that, presumably Matt wanted. It's been treated with the contempt it deserves, as I suspect Matt will be in the elections.

The 'movement' that Matt wants to represent seems mired in a bitter charicature of itself.

Come on lets be honest, Matt O'Connor was, is and always will be an egomaniac. What won’t he do to get and keep his name in lights? First it was F4J and his exploitation of disenfranchised fathers all of whom once he had his fill he deserted, all that is bar the very few so enamoured and entranced by him they refuse to realize his wilful manipulation of their needs the like of which he exploits by having them draw attention to his one and only cause namely himself by way of protest. Not surprising is it then that upon putting his name up for London Mayor so out he brings his minions as fall guys to highlight the one and only! Please Matt please don’t try and kid us anymore your for fathers, if so then its high time you climbed a crane or Buck palace instead of standing in front a media camera.

[...] Matt also has a massive chip on his shoulder about Scottish devolution, claiming that English voters subsidise cushty social policies north of the border. If what he says is true, this is another interesting area for debate. But O’Connor’s simplistic nationalism again mars the discussion, he spends more than half the video - remember, a party election broadcast for the London elections - whinging about the issue. Some of his campaign imagery verges on racism, according to fellow blogger ourkingdom. [...]

The English democrats are politically naive. They should demand independence for all the countries in the UK. Instead they prefer to whinge about the Scots while ignoring Oil revenues.

Westminster has 85% English MP's so it is effectively an English parliament in practice if not in name. It is certainly not the minority countries that are oppressing England, quite the reverse.

O'Connor pulls out of mayor race

Looks like the EDP had their doubts about the posters too.

The accusation of "racist" has been cheapened so much as to now be rendered worthless.

The English Democrats have been "reasonable" for the whole of the party's existence. This has merely led to a media blackout by the mainstream media which are all anti-England.

The reason we have 3rd rate politicians wrecking England is because of our 5th rate media.

The BBC reported today about a Cheshire village where the residents "voted" to go into Wales. It had also reported on a similar poll run by GMTV on Berwick Upon Tweed going into Scotland.

However, apart from a couple of broadcasts on BBC West Midlands the mainstream media completely censored the English Democrats' campaign in the Welsh Assembly elections to offer the people of Monmouthshire a referendum on the county returning to England.

Anti-English "racism" is very effective in misleading English people.

The only "racism" being carried out is against the English and it has the full weight of English law behind it.

Even members of the Scottish clergy are openly anti-English. One of its bigots remarking on the earthquake that hit England recently said "it couldn't happen to a nicer people". The problem is the Church of England holds broadly similar views and bans all things English, or at least attempts to.

Yes, there is no doubt that the establishment in England is full of the nastiest bigots, including the House of Commons where 80%+ of MPs are English. The nastiest bigots are those prejudiced against their own people.

Devolution made MPs in Scotland redundant in Scotland, where they are powerless. An English Parliament would render MPs in England redundant and this is the one and only reason the English are denied one.

Racism is nothing to do with biology. In fact, the worst racism occurs between peoples that are closely related, and almost indistinguishable to outsiders e.g. Serbs and Croats, Indians and Pakistanis. It's more about the perception of an ethnic difference than a biological reality. Hence Scots and English *can* be relatred to one another, even if there's little between them genetically and physically.

"Is it racist, really? The extent to which it is racist could be seen as a function of how much actual offence it causes to Scots, and how much real malice and prejudice it expresses towards the Scots. I don’t think either measures are particularly high; it’s just having a (possibly tasteless) joke at . . . their expenses."

Well, replace the guy in a kilt with someone in Asian/Hasidic/African costume, and then replace the "jock strapped" comment with one appropriate to whichever of these you choose... then make that call.

There are in fact a number of Scots in London, for one reason and another, and it could be claimed that they are a distinct minority in that city, the same as Irish, West Indians, Turks etc. What does a Scot who has lived in London for over ten years have to do with this? Yet it could be said to be inciting hatred towards them.

John Hill quote: "Having the cross of St. George associated .........with petty racism, bad puns and embarrassing haircuts will do no one any good."

Gareth Young quote: "I believe that’s the Maltese Cross.

And before you ask, I have no idea why the English Democrats are using it."

The poster might be a little more subtle than people give it credit for.

Correction: An English Parliament would render ALL MPs redundant in England and this is the one and only reason the English are denied one.

"Well, replace the guy in a kilt with someone in Asian/Hasidic/African costume, and then replace the 'jock strapped' comment with one appropriate to whichever of these you choose… then make that call.

"There are in fact a number of Scots in London, for one reason and another, and it could be claimed that they are a distinct minority in that city, the same as Irish, West Indians, Turks etc. What does a Scot who has lived in London for over ten years have to do with this? Yet it could be said to be inciting hatred towards them."

Yes, well; it isn't an Asian, Hasidic or African figure, is it, but just a caricatural Scot. And it's more likely to provoke mild mockery of Scottish regulars down the local - often jokingly but not 'racistically' referred to as 'Jock' - than real racial hatred. That's why I thought it would be interesting to see if anyone complains to the advertising standards authority on the grounds of racism, and whether such complaints would be upheld.

Besides, if you think this rather silly poster is racist, then it means you're already regarding the Scots as 'another' race or nationality from the English - which rather gives the lie to any idea that we are a single, British nation. If we were, then taunts directed at 'Jocks' would be no different in character from jokes made by southern English people at the expense of northerners or Brummies. Would you describe those as racist? Indeed, the extent to which this poster is regarded as potentially racist is a marker of the extent to which the English and Scots have already diverged into distinct nations. I'm reminded of those old war films in which you often hear the token Scot being teasingly referred to as 'Jock'. That was when we were more like a united British nation, albeit one dominated by England.

And re the Maltese Cross; Malta is one of the many countries that have St. George as their patron saint - so it is just another form of George's Cross. A bit disingenuous: it's fulfilling the function of the Cross of St. George in a covert way to avoid the 'racist' (?)associations of the English flag with racism.

David, aka Britology Watch

"Yes, well; it isn’t an Asian, Hasidic or African figure, is it, but just a caricatural Scot."

Sorry, but that's what I call DOUBLE STANDARDS. Why is it okay to mock my national costume, but not the costumes of any of these?

"And it’s more likely to provoke mild mockery of Scottish regulars down the local - often jokingly but not ‘racistically’ referred to as ‘Jock’ - than real racial hatred."

Most of the jokes I have heard about Jocks would not be tolerated if the word was replaced with one of the above.

For example, both Scots and Jews have had an unjustified reputation for being tight-fisted. Someone can crack jokes about money with Scots, but not about Jewish people on the TV.

Both are stereotypes.

"Besides, if you think this rather silly poster is racist, then it means you’re already regarding the Scots as ‘another’ race or nationality from the English"

As I said above, there is little or no biological difference between Scots and English people - in fact, it is easy for a member of one to become the other.

However, we are, and always have been, a different nationality. Like the Welsh and Irish.

"which rather gives the lie to any idea that we are a single, British nation. "

I've never considered there to be one, but even those Scots and Welsh who consider themselves to be "British" have little trouble in distinguishing between their nationality and the state that they live in. In England, Britishness and Englishness are entwined in more complicated way.

"If we were, then taunts directed at ‘Jocks’ would be no different in character from jokes made by southern English people at the expense of northerners or Brummies. Would you describe those as racist?"

Well, if you consider Scots "British", we are the northerners, aren't we? Yorkshire is barely half way down, but enough of the idiocies of British geography.

The Brummies are English, however, the jokes still rely on intolerance of something different to the joke teller. England has a serious issue about regional accents, and dialects, that results from overcentralisation but that's for another thread.

Clearly the twerp that Ok'd such a campaign is the very item which has been eradicated from the image ...

... seriously though, can you imagine the uproar if the SNP used an equivalent campaign?

For years the movement for for Scottish independence has been labelled as racist (anti-english), so if it can be said of that movement (which to my knowledge has never used this type of campaign) then it can most definitely be used in regard of this.

Gareth, having just perused your blog, I've come to the conclusion that you just don't get 'wind-up'.

If the English Democrat poster is humorous then this photgraph taken in Liverpool last year must be too.

http://flickr.com/photos/dave_sinclair_liverpool_photos/1351114448/in/photostream/

Is this racist http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=virxEqWRP5g

Is it racist? I don't know. 'Racist' implies a race.

Is it brain dead, sneeringly nasty, and likely to make the ED look like a bunch of hostile bigots - then yes, they have shot themselves in the foot. Most people will look at this and think, 'why the hell are the stirring up hatred between our neighbours'. The old minority vs majority aspects of racism are triggered with this sort of thing. Scotland ARE a minority, and sneering at them by a country with far more power just comes across as bullish, bullying, if you will.

Gareth

It sounds like a lot of your experience was football related and/or in drinking environments, something I am not really familiar with as I find those 'cultures' pretty uncivlised in general across the UK so don't participate. It's difficult, therefore, for me to comment on that.

My wife is English and has lived in Scotland for 20 years and hasn't had any bad experiences even on a relatively 'mild' level, so I don't agree that a 'daily gauntlet' is automatically 'part of the territory' with being English in Scotland, though I can quite believe people do experience that to some extent..

I'm not sure what you defy me to deny about Braveheart. I don't think many people see it as a documentary, it was Hollywood after all.

I think there is something about where about in England you come from i.e. south or north and also social class. That works the other way too.

For years the movement for for Scottish independence has been labelled as racist (anti-english)

For years it was anti-English. I don't think it is anymore, but the English Democrats are still on the learning curve that you've breached.

Scotland is still incredibly anglophobic - even if you do say "No offence intended, pal" after each offence - so I wouldn't get up on your high horse about it if I were you. I know it's all part of the 'friendly banter' up in Scotland, but vast tracts of Scotland are much less politically correct than England, and it's still quite common to hear Scots refer to Chinkies and Pakis when in England such language is frowned upon. I'm not saying that Scotland is more racist than England, there's no greater malice, but there is certainly less consideration to people of a sensitive disposition.

Don't get me wrong, I prefer the Scottish way, where people are less politically correct, and people less likely to 'be offended' (unless it's sectarian, which is still a huge problem in Scotland) but it's only because you are about ten years behind London in cultural attitudes.

I have a lot of mates from the Brechin (Aberdeen) area and when they are down in Brighton I warn them to moderate their language for their own safety. What washes in an Aberdeen pub does not go down too well in London or Brighton.

It's not racist, just plain old bigotry.

Is it racist? Difficult to say, perhaps defends on the mindset of the person/people who created it and the particular mindset of the people seeing it. When I worked in England I used to get that sort of 'banter'. I took it in good humour because it was meant in good humour, but it could have been quite different with other people. I think the same thing applies with 'banter' towards the English, sometimes it's harmless fun, sometimes it's not.

The interesting thing with the Jock/Taffy/Paddy aspect is that the Scots/Welsh/Irish don't have a similar name for the English (assuming you don't count 'English b#st#rds' - joke!).

Toque - When you talk about anti-English sentiment in Scotland are you talking about the independence movement (as Alasdair was referring to) or the country generally?

"Sorry, but that’s what I call DOUBLE STANDARDS. Why is it okay to mock my national costume, but not the costumes of any of these?"

Don't make me laugh, Ray; are you honestly suggesting that the picture on the poster is an accurate representation of how Scots generally dress these days? Whereas Asians, Hasidics and Africans are more likely to wear differentiating clothing from day to day, especially first-generation immigrants.

"Most of the jokes I have heard about Jocks would not be tolerated if the word was replaced with one of the above."

Yes, but if a word referring to one of the other ethnic groups had been used, it wouldn't be tolerated because it would be perceived as racist. There's no absolute watermark for what constitutes racism; and, as I said in my original comment, this would have to be judged on the basis of whether any malicious intention were present and whether it causes genuine offence, on a general basis to the 'race' or nation targeted, not just to one or two. From my very brief tour of Scottish online papers and blogs, not too many people seem to be that bothered. Certainly hasn't caused the same storm as Kelvin MacKenzie's Question Time comments a while back.

By the way, not many people seemed to question the irony of Kelvin MacKenzie's 'Scottophobia' when he has a Scottish grandfather - as if his Scottish origins weren't obvious from his name - Kelvin Calder MacKenzie, I ask you. Or is that being racist? No, just a stereotype.

David, aka Britology Watch

"Is it racist? I don’t know. ‘Racist’ implies a race."

No, it doesn't. As I said above, racism is usually neither scientific nor biological in origin.

"Scotland is still incredibly anglophobic - even if you do say “No offence intended, pal” after each offence - so I wouldn’t get up on your high horse about it if I were you. I know it’s all part of the ‘friendly banter’ up in Scotland, but vast tracts of Scotland are much less politically correct than England, and it’s still quite common to hear Scots refer to Chinkies and Pakis when in England such language is frowned upon. I’m not saying that Scotland is more racist than England, there’s no greater malice, but there is certainly less consideration to people of a sensitive disposition."

Well, if we're going to get into this, London based papers are more racist than Scottish based ones, with the possible exception of the Record. The Evening Standard was nicknamed "Der Stuermer" at one point. A lot of the other London papers carp on about Continentals in a racist manner, and also the Scots (although funnily enough, this stuff doesn't make it into the Scottish edition). The red tops have a lot to answer for, but even the Guardian isn't immune from a bit of Celt bashing from time to time. Nor is the BBC.

Toque says: "Scotland is still incredibly anglophobic" - I don't buy this at all, yes there are the odd twat, but to say that it's incredibly anglophobic is misrepresenting the situation.

"it’s still quite common to hear Scots refer to Chinkies and Pakis when in England such language is frowned upon. I’m not saying that Scotland is more racist than England, there’s no greater malice, but there is certainly less consideration to people of a sensitive disposition." - again I don't buy this, yes there are pockets of ill-educated idiots, but you seem to be trying to paint a picture as if that's what the vast majority are like. It's not. it could just be the circles you move in?!

Given your comments it's funny that parties like the BNP have completely failed to gain any sort of foothold in Scotland, whilst the same cannot be said so in England. Your notion of what is considered acceptable and where seems to be somewhat skewed.

I actually suspect that your comments are a wind-up so ho-hum then ...

As to the poster, the most offensive thing about it is the misrepresentation of the facts ... Scotland doesn't have any of London's money!

Why blame the Scottish people and attack them with this drivel? This sort of rubbish has done no good for anyone. Anti-Scottish hatred and scapegoating in London will simply increase whilst the EDs have portrayed themselves as racist.

When will we English take responsibility for ourselves rather than blame other innocent people? Blame English politicians, there are 529 in the British Parliament!

The struggle for democracy is people versus politicians, not people versus people. So no more racism against Celts, how otherwise are we going to get rid of the old image of English racist bully?

The Establishment must be laughing on how the ED and others are turning English people against Scottish people.

Divide and conquer springs to mind!

Depends on what you find incredible.

Scotland has relatively few non-white immigrants, so I don't find it that surprising.

Hamish, I'm talking about the country generally, I don't think separatists are anymore anti-English. You can break it down by which football teams Scots support, the supporters of Celtic, Hibs and Aberdeen are incredibly anglophobic.

I do think Scotland has become less anglophobic since devolution.

"The Establishment must be laughing on how the ED and others are turning English people against Scottish people"

I don't buy this at all - what possible interest can the Establisment have in turning English people against Scottish people?

The Establishment is dominated by Scots and puts their welfare before that of English people. It needs to keep the English quiet and compliant so that they will continue to pay for the Union and resign themselves to lower standards of health, education and social services than are available in Scotland.

I see plenty of Scots in the Westminster establishment, but few of them actually fight for Scotland.

"what possible interest can the Establisment have in turning English people against Scottish people?"

By making it look like it is the Scots that are refusing England decent medical care, care for the elderly, tuition fees etc, when it is the English Establishment that is doing this.

[...] the English Democrats racist? That’s the question posed on this thread on the Our Kingdom blog.  The question has been raised in reference to a poster (below) which [...]

"I don’t buy this at all - what possible interest can the Establisment have in turning English people against Scottish people?"

English nationalists can waste time criticising the Scots who, from what I hear want independence, whilst the English Establishment can continue to run England as they like. Classic divide and rule, as I said before.

What should we want? Democracy or nationalist quarrels. It would be better if we joined Scottish and Welsh nationalists in demanding democracy from the Establishment.

"English nationalists can waste time criticising the Scots who, from what I hear want independence"

Sadly, you're wrong. According to the latest polls, support for Scottish independence in Scotland is around 30%. There's more support for it in England than in Scotland.

"the English Establishment can continue to run England"

Who is this mysterious "English Establishment"? Brown, Darling, Alexander, Lord Falconer, etc? And it wasn't English but Scottish MPs who carried the vote on foundation hospitals and top-up fees for English students in full knowledge that their own constituents weren't affected.

"It would be better if we joined Scottish and Welsh nationalists in demanding democracy from the Establishment."

But how do we do this if every time we try to discuss legitimate concerns like the institutionalised discrimination against English students, OAPs ad hospital patients, people like you object?

"According to the latest polls, support for Scottish independence in Scotland is around 30%. There’s more support for it in England than in Scotland."

The only difference is Scotland has a Parliament and we don't. I think the Scots are wondering, as am I, why so many English nationalists are wasting their time quarrelling with the Scots rather than campaigning for an English Parliament from the overcentralized Unionist government.

The Scots have made progress, they have campaigned and finally gained their Parliament. Now it is time we did the same. We won't get a Parliament by complaining to the Scots, but by holding the British Parliament to account.

"Who is this mysterious “English Establishment?"

The usual suspects, the House of Commons, the House of Lords, the national press in London, the ones that don't usually mention England.

"Brown, Darling, Alexander, Lord Falconer, etc?"

So if Cameron wins the next election (very likely) or Clegg (very unlikely) and they say that an English Parliament isn't needed, would you happy to say "That's fine, these are governments with English ministers, whatever they say goes." You might be happy with this, but I wouldn't be.

Don't mix English nationalism with xenophobia.

"people like you object?"

People like me? What people like me who are want an English Parliament rather than wasting time picking fights with our neighbours?

Certainly Hamish,

I had my jaw broken in two places by some madman screaming "English C*nt" (completely unprovoked I might add).

My local pub (my local) offered anyone wearing a German top a free pint when England were playing Germany and they served German sausages and other German foods as part of their match day promotion.

I was regularly insulted and threatened for being English, mainly by Fenian-type Celtic supporters who like to call you a 'blue-nose' simply because you are English (ironically this was because I went to a lot of Hibs and Celtic pubs because I had a lot of Hibs and Celtic supporting friends).

I was ejected from a Glasgow bar simply for wearing an England top by the bouncers "for my own protection" - there were loads of Scots in there wearing Germany shirts.

I was assailed by anglophobic advertising, and I came into work one day to find my office plastered in Argentina strips.

I could give you many more examples but...well...I made many good friends in Scotland, and I will be up in Edinburgh for a wedding in June. I can say with absolute sincerity that I love Scotland, it's where I met and fell in love with my wife, who is a MacDonald. And I have relatives of my own who are Scottish (my Grandma is a Stuart).

Some of the friends I made in Scotland are amongst my very best friends, and many of them made the long trip over the Atlantic for my wedding in the Rockies. On the whole I find Scots a charming and lovely people, but there is definitely an anglophobic undercurrent to Scottish society. To be anti-English in Scotland is a dinner party joke - it's like being anti-French in England, but less of a joke. Sadly a lot of Scots actually took the film Braveheart to be a documentary. All Scots are aware of it and I defy you to deny it. I lived in Scotland for five years and I can count the number of aggressive or intimidating incidents on two hands, but the snide remarks/jokes/friendly-banter is a daily gauntlet to run if you are English in Scotland. It goes with the territory.

In spite of the fact that I am a northerner I have a "posh" accent, by virtue of having a grammar school education, and for some reason this does seem to rub some Scots up the wrong way. I've noticed that Scots don't seem to react with such hostility to a Mancunian accent or a Geordie accent, which leads me to believe that the prejudice might be in part class-based. Perhaps you can enlighten me on that?

Toque

Sorry for late reply but can you elaborate on 'incredibly anglophobic' as in concrete examples, etc?

Oscar, I don't understand the point you are making in my direction. I wouldn't call the EDP poster humourous - I think it's in pretty poor taste.

I don't see a connection to that photo that you've linked to though.

Hamish, yes football connected, but more importantly drink related (ie neds and schemies on the piss). I would hazard a guess that your wife has less occasion to encounter these people than did I.

I think the Scottish anglophobia Gareth describes is definitely class-related, just as the reverse is probably true: that 'southern', 'posh'- / middle-class-sounding people often pour scorn 'humorously' on working-class accents, both English or Scottish indiscriminately. (Would it also be true that your Glaswegian working-class drinker would reserve equal derision for his 'English-apeing' middle-class compatriot from Edinburgh?)

British English (language, that is) accents illustrate the complex interrelationships between different 'tribes': those of class, region and nation. However, it is the case that 'regional' accents (which, from the class perspective, also includes Scottish and Welsh accents) are predominantly associated in popular thinking with the working class; whereas, posh, middle-class English is associated with the 'English establishment' and the dominant class (middle / upper-middle) across the UK (Scotland included; cf. the Edinburgh example).

Hence, the antagonism Gareth's middle-class English accent provoked was indeed a combination of national and class-based; whereas a stronger regional accent would perhaps have identified Gareth as someone who, though English, shared the antipathy to the 'dominant' south of England.

David, aka Britology Watch

The truth of the matter is you get the same sort of ignorant t***ers on either side of the border. I've heard of similar stories only from Scots who've stayed in England ... sad but true.

I don't think you can use it to label a nation. If we could then I could label everyone in England as being an 'arrogant twat' based on my experiences of a few English rugby fans. Obviously that would be an incorrect assumption to make ... arrogant (and ignorant) twats exist everywhere!